Supporting and promoting the well-being of mental health carers and their families.
Mental Health Carers Austalia.
06-08-2015 05:55 AM
06-08-2015 05:55 AM
@CherryBomb wrote:Hi everyone,
I saw the conversation that unfolded here on Tuesday night, and I felt like some space was needed to let the dust settle before I could contribute. Forgive me, if this interpretation of the situation is wrong - perhaps others feel like there was no dust to settle. But this is exactly my point, this is my interpretation, and what's true for you, may not hold true for me.
I'm concerned about members on here feeling misunderstood, and it saddens me to think that some members feel disrepected. It can be really upsetting to have someone tell you what you're thinking, when you're not thinking that way at all. And in reverse, it can be equally upsetting for someone to be told they are thinking a certain way, when they are not.
I'd like to point out here that we all bring our own worldviews for seeing a situation. Like this image below, some may see two animals glaring at each other, others will see a tree. What we see and experience in a situation, might be perceived and experienced as completely different for someone else.
Hi @CherryBomb
My heartfelt thanks for this post of yours. I know I've taken a long time to stick my nose out of my cave and sniff the air again, but your post certainly helped encourage me to step back into this circle. I really admire and appreciate your grace.
Nobody has to agree with my perceptions of my life -- and believe me I'm quite accustomed to the fact that people rarely do -- but then, they're not walking in my shoes. For several years, I had a friend from the Lakota First Nation in the US, who taught me many things -- she's gone now, killed in suspicious circumstances on a lonely road in Africa, and she leaves a very empty space -- and one of her absolute fundamentals she would state as "Take from no man his song". For me, that means to ask someone what they're searching for, rather than assuming you know what would be good for them.
I hope this isn't taken as justification, but a word on what it is that I personally am searching for, and why I've posted what I've posted here in the past:
I'm travelling a very solitary path these days; I have no family, no companions, to do the social grooming of picking metaphorical salt crust and lice from my fur; no-one to willingly spend time with me and thereby give the subliminal reassurances that I'm okay and of some inherent value. In that empty environment, it becomes increasingly difficult to parse events of my life, to understand what they do or don't mean, and to know how much weight and how much notice I should give to anything that happens. So I write them here. And yes I'm often verbose, of course I realise that, but it gives me a sense of feeling my way through it. It gives me at last the illusion of talking with someone, and if people make a comment, or blessdly give reassurance by saying "I understand what you mean", or stimulate my thought by saying "Dont you find that ..." ... then that's a massive bonus to me. I may be in a cave, but at least it's just a couple of valleys over from the tribe, not on another planet. What I'm *not* doing is saying "Oh woe is me" or "Isn't the world horrible", regardless of people's assumptions; I'm saying, "Hey guess what happened to me today", because my cupboard is otherwise pretty bare and I don't have many things to contribute to the communal meal.
But one thing I really don't need in my life is more messages of "You're not OK" and "You shouldn't be like that" and "You'd be so much better if you were like X" (which generally really means "if you were more like me"). I'd rather be asked how I enjoy wearing yellow Dunlop Volleys than be told in a loud voice that fill the room and halts the dancing that no-one wears them anymore, and I really should be buying Brand X. (Even if they don't make shoes that actually fit me.)
@Alessandra1992, @PeppiPatty, thanks for the friendliness. @Alessandra1992, I would chop wood for you anytime, if the offer still stands. 😉
06-08-2015 09:18 PM
06-08-2015 09:18 PM
Hi @Aonaran
I'm so pleased to hear that you've ventured out of the cave and have stepped into the Forums agains. It's great to see you back on here.
Thank you for letting us in on what you're searching for when you post on these Forums, and more importantly thanks for letting us know what you don't need in your life. It helps me understand what the boundaries are.
Your metaphors really resonate with me. In particular, you wrote:
"I'm travelling a very solitary path these days; I have no family, no companions, to do the social grooming of picking metaphorical salt crust and lice from my fur; no-one to willingly spend time with me and thereby give the subliminal reassurances that I'm okay and of some inherent value."
I guess what stands out for me is that gorillas (is that what your profile pic is?), like humans, are generally social beings. So for the individuals who are cave dwellers, I hope they can find a community that can provide some social interaction and connection that is helpful for them. I hope we can do this for you as a community.
How is venturing out of the cave? I ask this because in my own experience, stepping out of my cave can feel so bright and noisey, to the point where I want to retreat back into my cave. I wonder if this is something that you can relate to?
Anyway @Aonaran. I'm glad you're back, and I'm looking forward to hearing back from you.
CB
07-08-2015 11:15 AM
07-08-2015 11:15 AM
Hi @Aonaran
I'm new. We havent met before. I read your thread with interest and was delighted by your turn of phrase. I have not had much delight in my life so when I say it .. it really means something.
I was really saddened when you disappeared. Shit happens and dust settles. Glad you are back.
07-08-2015 05:45 PM
07-08-2015 05:45 PM
Hi Aonaran,
Yep preety sure you exist..I saw your post ( Checked my medications and I wasn't delusinal)
A lot of folks dont GET the journey we are on , some get first class , secondclass some even get to drive the train. But some of us lay the track..
Nothing to be proud of you say.. Then know I am proud for you with your first post..I is intimidating and daugnting but you did quite well.
I have been through a pretty rough patch recently but found my old go to line.
be yourself AND allow yourself to be..
no blame no ridiclue no second guessing no trying to live up to expectations of others or " society " .
i'm very surethere is no rule book on life other than the ones we write for ourselves.
as to what might have been maybe try what can i do now. Dont make it big ,,my goal the other day was get out of bed ...i partly succeeded ( mainly due to a very full bladder) I think I set a personal record in both volume and time it took to empty ..That was my achievement for the day.
When your in the hole it seems you only have a shovel ( it makes holes deeper) but at some point you get thrown a ladder or carve your own niches in the wall and manage to climg up if not completley out.
Love the Monkey Pic BTW.. you should try to brandish Hope like that monkey weilds a bone..
19-08-2015 01:43 PM
19-08-2015 01:43 PM
Greetings @CherryBomb
I appreciate your hearing me, I genuinely do. I hope the reference to boundaries doesn't mean I'm being put into cotton wool, as someone you have to dance around. I would have thought not wanting to be told what's so about oneself, without recognition of the fact that it's subjective and transferrent, would be something everyone would want. Am I wrong about that?
I don't want to rehash things, but I'd taken a break from the forum because ... well, frankly, it bothers me that such an approach is prominent in people's approach to support here; I personally find it extremely concerning. My own perception of many of the posts here is that the people behind them are a bit exhausted from other "normal" people trying to impose their realities onto our community; I see and hear the subtle inducements in the "real" world, the creeping invalidations of people that say, "You're only okay if you behave like me." So to venture back to the forums and get a dose of the same thing was very difficult to take. Surely these forums can be a shelter where that doesn't happen? Perhaps I'm very very wrong, and no-one will agree with me, and then I'll know that this isn't the place for me. It feels very, very important to me, and I was genuine in saying thank you for hearing me, but I feel very anxious about feeling that I'm being "tolerated".
My avatar is a still shot from one of my all-time favourite films, Stanley Kubrick's 2001: A Space Odyssey. That film changed my life in so many ways -- not least, sadly, making me realise that my family and I didn't see eye-to-eye on pretty much anything at all. I still remember that dawning realisation on the drive home from the drive-in where I saw it as a kid, and listening to the rest of my family saying the most inane, rubbishing things pretty much solely because they didn't understand the film. (Yes, it's a hard film to come to grips with, but it was uch simpler than that: they didn't understand it, so they tore it down. And guess what happened to me?) It wasn't the start of my estrangement and disenfranchisement from my family's politic, but it was very clear to me that I didn't feel safe with them from that moment on.
Anyhow. That's not the primary reason I chose it. Most importantly, the film fired me with ideas. On a Myers-Briggs scale I'm an extreme introvert, so it's ideas that energise me, and frankly make me feel so inadequate to the task. The image in my avatar is the moment where the proto-human ape first learns how to use tools, and the entire universe is suddenly, incredibly open to him. I crave those moments -- and I've had a fair few of them, I'm fortunate to say -- where something clicks into place, and the world suddenly looks new and different and exciting again, and so that image represents that aspect of me.
And it's also a reminder that I don't know everything, that there's always more to unfold. I've always been someone who's more comfortable knowing the question than knowing the answer, because answers shut off other possibilities.
But you're right to pick up on the social aspect of my metaphors. For me, the overwhelming tone of my life is loneliness. And it's humiliating. I'm sorry I let the bitterness out on the forum, but it felt for me that the only alternative to that was to give in to the compliance I've always sunk into before, which has made me realise that many (most?) people just want to be "right", and don't care about the aftermath. There's a reason I named this thread the way I did.
Venturing out of my cave is getting to be very hard. I don't feel part of this world, and it immobilises me. I'm reading a couple of books at the moment that are at least bolstering me: Elaine Aron's "The Highly Sensitive Person", which at least offers validation and strategies, even if it hasn't yet helped to lift me out of the "I-don't-wanna"; and Barbara Ehrenreich's "Bright-Sided", which shines some light on our growing obsession with looking no matter what like we're "in charge" with our lives and the increasing social sanctions against admitting any missteps or inabilities. (It was written for the Americans, but it's increasingly pertinent to Australia as well.) Those two books are giving me a sense, at least, that I'm not alone with this, something my own "real world" doesn't do.
Hmmm. One day, maybe, I'll write a three-line reply, do you think? (No, I don't see it happening either.)
Genuine regards to you, @CherryBomb, and to all the forumites.
A.
19-08-2015 01:47 PM
19-08-2015 01:47 PM
Oh @Appleblossom,
Your post has lifted my heart. I really can't say how much I appreciate your kindness. 😉
Thank you, thank you.
I'm sorry to hear you say you haven't had much delight in your life. I hear you, and respect you. If there's anything I can do or say to help lift the Delight-Factor, then I'd be happy to contribute.
Kind regards,
A.
19-08-2015 02:00 PM
19-08-2015 02:00 PM
G'day @Tight-Control,
Your post made me smile. So much appreciated! 😉
For what it's worth, I'm pretty sure I exist, as well. My chief difficulty seems to be in convincing others that I do. Or at least that I exist on my own terms, rather than on theirs. It's an ongoing negotiation.
I don't have much of a relationship with Hope, to be honest. She's a fickle mistress at best, and I'm pretty sure she's flat-out pathological. I tend to keep my distance.
Actually that's just given me an idea for a story I'm trying to write. Hey, thanks!! Better go before I lose it ...
Slàinte,
A.
19-08-2015 02:01 PM - edited 19-08-2015 02:02 PM
19-08-2015 02:01 PM - edited 19-08-2015 02:02 PM
@Aenoran
I am in the middle of reading your message.
I have had a little break from the forums because :
1: i went to Psychotherapy to get my head clear on some important past memories.
Also I didnt understand my reliance on the forums when so many of my cherished friends have longer breaks than me.
But it is how it is. You people are who I need. My Psychotherapist though got my brain into gear and I'm ready to start doing writing again.
In the forums and my own.
19-08-2015 02:07 PM
19-08-2015 02:07 PM
But you already lifted my delight factor with your "lice" metaphor. Just keep doing more of the same. I am allergic to excess sugar.
Shit, after I read that my son's gorgeous brought scabies into the house and I have been washing like mad for 4 weeks as he had to do the treatment twice. And yes lemons into lemonade is old hat for me I use it as a biology lesson for him and teach re macro/micro stuff.
You maahhhst be PSI kik. But I am not a frou frou hippy lala type reeely. @chookmojo is that a copywritable phrase or did you hear it elsewhere?
I have lived on poetry for 30 years .. I love a well turned phrase. Love your chrissie cactus too .. @Aonaran but it can keep in cyberland for me.
19-08-2015 02:15 PM
19-08-2015 02:15 PM
Hi @Aenoran
Im stuck on the ........
Second paragraph...thank you for your highly perceptive observations.
I feel acknowledged.
Can I write something....
Call me a neurotic hysteric with tendency to .psychotic depression ......with past ...brain damage......
I went to visit Mum on Monday. She said.... hey Anne...nice skirt. I answered yes, it is isnt it? Theres a woman with times of mental ill health who lives near me and she spends most of her days searching beautiful skirts around Perth. She wears them once or twice and then she chucks them. I found this one in the bin. See my shoes? You dont wanna know where i got them from.
Ive ordered Darian Leader's a Psychoanalyst's book on Bi-Polar which I think will be very interesting.
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Supporting and promoting the well-being of mental health carers and their families.
Mental Health Carers Austalia.
Our Mission
To be the voice of mental health carers to enable the best life possible.
Get In Touch With Us
We're here to support and promote the well-being of mental health carers and their families
Mental Health Carers Australia is the only national advocacy group solely concerned with the well-being and promotion of the needs of mental health carers.
Supporting and promoting the well-being of mental health carers and their families.
Mental Health Carers Austalia.
Our Mission
To be the voice of mental health carers to enable the best life possible.
Get In Touch With Us
We're here to support and promote the well-being of mental health carers and their families
Mental Health Carers Australia is the only national advocacy group solely concerned with the well-being and promotion of the needs of mental health carers.